tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6753820.post115100948577677664..comments2023-10-30T04:16:25.917-04:00Comments on Sentient Developments: When did intelligence first emerge in the universe?Georgehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13003484633933455827noreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6753820.post-64558224280242458782008-12-18T04:44:00.000-05:002008-12-18T04:44:00.000-05:00The whole of the article above assumes that our ki...The whole of the article above assumes that our kind of life (planetary bound carbon based)is the only type to exist. What about plasma life forms that might appear on the surfaces of suns? Though purely conjectural we shouldn't dismiss the idea of both life and intelligence that are unlike our own.<BR/>The outcome of thinking about such things is that, in some cases intelligent life (of an incredibly alien kind) could have appeared much earlier than we presume.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6753820.post-72406395345974342732008-03-06T13:35:00.000-05:002008-03-06T13:35:00.000-05:00I want to know:WHEN DID THE FIRST GALAXIES FORM IN...I want to know:<BR/><BR/>WHEN DID THE FIRST GALAXIES FORM IN THE UNIVERSE?<BR/><BR/>plzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz!!! TELL ME!!!!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6753820.post-39433286593719385792007-08-09T19:35:00.000-04:002007-08-09T19:35:00.000-04:00In direct response to your question "so where is e...In direct response to your question "so where is everybody?", I would posit that the enormous distances between stellar bodies offers a solid and plausible explanation for the Great Silence(the closest observable planetary system outside our own biosphere by ground-based telescopes is only forty-one light years away, but still an incomprehensibly vast distance). The unsettling truth is that we are a speck on a speck within another speck called the milky Way galaxy. There are more stars in the universe than there are grains of sand on all the beaches of the world. We exist on the outer bands of a galactic arm in a relatively empty region of interstellar space. Given this, even the most advanced civilizations in the cosmos(and they may in fact be quite abundant), beings millions if not billions of years ahead of us in the development of their science and understanding of the higher realms of consciousness may not even be aware of our existence, even if they have developed the technological capacity for inter-dimensional travel. We should not presume that we are anything more than practically invisible, just as our nearest sentient cosmic neighbors obviously appear to be.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6753820.post-71186758137777295252007-06-27T13:10:00.000-04:002007-06-27T13:10:00.000-04:00I have issues with the 3.7 billion year estimate f...I have issues with the 3.7 billion year estimate for the development of complex life in the context of your article.<BR/><BR/>If earth was indeed rare, and life-friendly environments were extraordinarily uncommon then yes, it'd be safe to assume that your estimate is close to the minimum timespan required for the appearance of some kind of proto-intelligence.<BR/><BR/>The underlying argument, however, would also make it a lot less likely that planets with the necessary conditions for complex life formed in our galaxy anytime soon after planet formation became possible metallicity-wise, therefore reducing the likelihood of such life developing at a much earlier point in the history of our galaxy than today.<BR/><BR/>If, on the other hand, the mediocrity principle holds, it would seem reasonable to believe that the 3.7 gy you mentioned are closer to the average evolution timespan for earth-like planets, with the minimum being much lower.<BR/><BR/>Thus, under this assumption, intelligent life should have developed somewhat (maybe a lot) earlier than 4.42 gy ago.<BR/><BR/>Just some thoughts...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6753820.post-65815180382366286892007-06-01T08:48:00.000-04:002007-06-01T08:48:00.000-04:00I think the FIRST civ to attain singularity (a see...I think the FIRST civ to attain singularity (a seemengly cosmological inevitability) has been FORCED - to guarantee its own long term survivability due to otherwise inevitable competition for cosmic resources - to make all in its powers (a LOT by definition) to make sure there will NOT be a second civ attaining tech singularity.<BR/>This does not mean they would wave to colonize-or-perish, nor that they would have to sterilize-or-perish.<BR/>They would just have to deploy self replicating monitoring/enforcment probes that would guarantee that no other civ guets to the point of being a potencial SECOND post-singularity competitor ENFORCING them to a permanent one-star-at-a-time noncompetitive survival mode by forcefully and sistematically DENIYNG them tech-singularity.<BR/>So this is my explanation for fermy paradox: ONE post-singularity civ does exits, surving in a one/few-star/s-at-a-time mode (no need for more), marveling at the diversity of evolution everywhere else while making sure that NO one else guets to the many-stars-at-a-time stage just because having many civs in a many-stars-at-a-time mode would lead to inevitable colision and destruction.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6753820.post-43138612561894841322007-01-14T03:07:00.000-05:002007-01-14T03:07:00.000-05:00Interesting blog, just ran into it and it's now on...Interesting blog, just ran into it and it's now on my feeds.<br /><br />In your <a href="http://sentientdevelopments.blogspot.com/2006/12/quantum-mechanics-forbids-single.html">previous entries you mention how quantum mechanics forbids a single history</a> and although I have not yet begun to parse through your <a href="http://sentientdevelopments.blogspot.com/2006/12/must-know-terms-for-todays.html">must know terms for today's intellegensia</a> I'm assuming your fairly aware of other philosophies that share sentiments with these new theoretical physics. (to avoid ubersimplicity, I'll even ignore your interest in <a href="http://sentientdevelopments.blogspot.com/2006/12/buddha-break-20061229.html"> Buddhism</a>.<br /><br /><a href"http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ontology">Ontologically</a> I am under the impression that intelligence is a state of consciousness which, like consciousness, is atemporal. Human beings simply have reached a level of complexity with our minds that enables us to experience this pre-existing intelligence. The Universe (defined as the set of all sets here, by me - who am I? some poor kid) is conscious and intelligent, because we are conscious and intelligent. We are a part of the Universe, and the Universe is greater than the sum of it's parts (think Eisetein's montage - film theory where two semiotics together form something beyond the sum of the original two). <br /><br />Even in the case of multiple histories/futures/presents (all the same, personally I believe there is just 'now' and those are all reflections of 'now' manifesting as a myriad of space-time), there would in that infinite set have to be some timelines in which intelligence occured before our timeline. I am resisting falling into a loop here, but I'll leave it at -- perhaps if you go down our black holes and big bangs you'll just end up at the future.<br /><br />Final answer: now.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6753820.post-1168621167716175462007-01-12T11:59:00.000-05:002007-01-12T11:59:00.000-05:00I have yet seen no satisfying explanation to Fermi...I have yet seen no satisfying explanation to Fermi's paradox, I am convinced at the best of my ability it is a paradox - which leaves me deeply troubled. <BR/><BR/>Worst, I can add nothing else. Ray's conclusion (we are first) is a stretch. But what other explanations do we have? Pretty few.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6753820.post-1153503660899833782006-07-21T13:41:00.000-04:002006-07-21T13:41:00.000-04:00I enjoyed your analysis quite a bit. The thing you...I enjoyed your analysis quite a bit. The thing you didn't cover is the idea we still don't have a clue, which we don't. More treatments like yours, however will help us pick a good direction.Craighttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03844585470434099255noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6753820.post-1152850879247071712006-07-14T00:21:00.000-04:002006-07-14T00:21:00.000-04:00Does anyone know if any work has been done on the ...Does anyone know if any work has been done on the subject of how much waste heat would be generated by a singularity event? I'm thinking in terms of the fact that all computation, like all physical action, generates at least some degree of waste heat ( just no getting around thermodynamics) Assuming our civilization gives rise to a computational matrix that independently evolves in processing power exponentially, wouldn't that result in a catastrophic and possibly terminal heat-shock to the host-biosphere? Maybe that's the fate of all civilizations that reach singularities. I'd love it if anyone has any ideas to share on this...Chrishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02303755181174414108noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6753820.post-1151434449290464622006-06-27T14:54:00.000-04:002006-06-27T14:54:00.000-04:00Stanislaw Lem offered a very neat (and devastating...Stanislaw Lem offered a very neat (and devastating) resolution to the Fermi Paradox in his novel FIASCO (recommended).<BR/><BR/>In FIASCO, humanity tries its hardest to reach an alien civilization... only to find that the aliens are so physically different from us, that ANY actual communication is impossible. <BR/><BR/>"They" may be both intelligent and technologically advanced, but what if they are slime molds? Or fungi? What business do fungi want with primates? Seriously.<BR/><BR/>But here's another suggestion...<BR/><BR/>I wrote an "alien contact" novel years ago (available to read for free here: http://yngve.bravehost.com/aboutalienbeach.html), and I assumed that "they" would have be distinctly humanoid or the "contact" was going to be a non-starter.<BR/><BR/>The humanoids in that scenario turn out to be tourists rather than invaders -- and just as damaging to the "natives" (us) as real tourists would be to any "unspoiled" island culture.<BR/><BR/>The answer to the question "where are they?" is suggested in my novel as follows: the major part of the alien civilization became so advanced that they merged with their technoloy and vanished out of sight, perhaps to another reality -- i.e. a "singularity" -- and the "tourist" aliens who visit Earth are simply the tiny "un-evolved" remainder of that culture.<BR/><BR/>Ergo: if we run into an apparent older-than-mankind alien civilization, it will not be the ACTUAL alien civilization -- but merely its rejects, retards and Luddites.<BR/>;-)A.R.Yngvehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03972668378286177600noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6753820.post-1151290809304049952006-06-25T23:00:00.000-04:002006-06-25T23:00:00.000-04:00ryan wrote: "So personally I think its possible th...ryan wrote: "So personally I think its possible that there could be many races through the galaxy with human level intelligence, who survive and do quite well yet never get beyond tribalism."<BR/><BR/>Ryan, I often think about this as a distinct possibility. I believe Jared Diamond concluded as much (either directly or indirectly) in Guns, Germs and Steel.<BR/><BR/>Interestingly, I believe Drake factored this into his famous equation, realizing that not all civs will progress to the radio transmitting stage.Georgehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13003484633933455827noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6753820.post-1151275822580980122006-06-25T18:50:00.000-04:002006-06-25T18:50:00.000-04:00Very interesting question. One thought I had is t...Very interesting question. One thought I had is that even if human level intelligence is not rare, the circumstance we find ourselves in, of being serious universe observers and contemplating galaxy exploration and all the rest, still could be.<BR/><BR/>Human level intelligence existed for many thousands of years with no signs of real scientific or technological progress or sophistication. We used our intelligence primarily to trick lesser animals and thrive at a very basic level of existence. The fact that we didn't simply carry on like that forever could be very unusual.<BR/><BR/>Consider Native American culture for example. Obviously we can't say for sure, but I think its very possible that left alone they would never 'progress' beyond where they were before the Europeans came.<BR/><BR/>Even today there are still 'pristine' human tribes which have survived through the years without any sort of modern technology or science as we know it.<BR/><BR/>So personally I think its possible that there could be many races through the galaxy with human level intelligence, who survive and do quite well yet never get beyond tribalism.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6753820.post-1151122702679086802006-06-24T00:18:00.000-04:002006-06-24T00:18:00.000-04:00It's really quite simple. Our entire universe is a...It's really quite simple. Our entire universe is a simulation. We are the first entities to reach super-intelligence and will rapidly consume all available universal resources prior to the natural evolution of any other intelligent species. We will then begin spawning additional universal simulations to solve several Very Tricky Problems (TM).<BR/><BR/>I've got proof for all this lying around here somewhere.Aronhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08208584151586933163noreply@blogger.com